The rhythm section from Dio’s Holy Diver & The Last In Line (Vinny Appice-drums & Jimmy Bain-bass) have teamed up with ex-David Lee Roth guitarist Brian Young, ex-Quiet Riot guitarist Carlos Cavazo & ex-Bonham singer Chas Webs for a new super-ground called 3 Legged Dogg.

 Their 1st album; Frozen Summer, resembles soulful & bluesy kick ass hard rock from the 70’s, in the vein of Free & Led Zeppelin.

 I recently spoke with Vinny Appice about 3 Legged Dogg, Dio & much more. Check it out.

METAL HELL: How did 3 Legged Dogg project come about?

VINNY APPICE: It came about actually with doing this band called The Hollywood All-Stars & it’s actually the same band except there’s another drummer & his name is Crigger. He put that band together & he had an offer to do a benefit for the Great White fire victims so he eventually called us & it was a little bit of a different line-up & we did that show & then we got offers to do more shows. It eventually wound up being the line-up with Carlos Cavazo on guitar, Jimmy Bain on bass, Chas Webs on vocals & me & Crigger on drums. Then we started writing our own stuff & we decided to put out a CD. It just came out last week over the internet. We called it 3Legged Dogg. As far as past bands, this is something new. It’s not a Black Sabbath. It’s not a Dio. It’s our own thing so we’re more in control of what’s going on with decisions. It’s not a pre-established thing, as was Black Sabbath.

MH: How long has the writing been going on?

VA: It went on for about 6 to 8 months last year. I have a little studio in my house & we would write all the stuff & record it & pretty much made a pre-production record here basically. There were just electronic drums & everybody would play through their pedal boards into the computer but it sounded great. When we went into the studio we just recorded it that much faster. We knew what we wanted to do so it was pretty quick.

MH: Do you prefer to go for 1st takes more or to keep going until its perfect?

VA: I like to go for the first 3 or 4 takes. Sometimes the first takes are good & the energy is good, but then they might be a little bit sloppy, sometimes it takes a little bit of playing. Certain songs call for different approaches. On a couple of songs the first takes were really good. On a couple of songs it took a while to get into the groove & the feel of the song. And now with the computers & pro tools & this & that, you could do half the song & then punch in the other half when you learn it (laughing) so…

MH: How do you feel about recording on tape compared to pro tools?

VA: I like the fact that you’ve got control with pro tools. You can fix different things & you’re basically looking at the music, but to me sometimes the drums sound a little bit softer than they should in pro tools. I don’t know if it’s that particular program or what, but they sound a little less mean when it’s recorded with pro tools, than going straight to tape. I don’t know if that’s just me or if anybody else hears it that way but it’s pretty weird.

MH: There’s more warmth on tape I think.

VA: Yeah, (more) warmth, there’s more aggression. You hear the attack of the drums more & with pro tools it sounds good & everything but they just seem a little bit more mellow, I don’t know what it is.

MH: How did you hook up with Carlos Cavazo & the rest of the band?

VA: Like I said, we did this thing for the Great White fire victims & that started it but I knew Chas West from when he was in the band Bonham. We played together in South America (when) I was in Dio & he was in Bonham, so I knew him from back then. I knew he was a good singer & everything so I kept him in mind & then I ran into him at a party a couple years ago & said what are you doing & he wasn’t doing too much so I said maybe we should get together. Me & Jimmy Bain have always been in touch & Carlos ran into him at some club in L.A. & he’d just left Quiet Riot. He was interested in doing something so we just all hooked up. It was kind of being in the right place at the right time.

MH: Do you lock in more with the bass or guitar?

VA: I follow the bass more & he follows me & we go back & forth. We’ve been playing together for so long it’s pretty easy to follow each other. I like locking up with the bass & tighten it up that way. That makes for a tighter band, to get the bass & drums tight. That usually lays down a great foundation.

MH: Going back, how did you get the gig with Black Sabbath after Bill Ward left?

VA: They were doing the Heaven & Hell tour & Bill Ward left the band. They were in need of a drummer & they heard of me. They heard one of the albums I did back then which was a 3 piece band called Axis. It was kinda my own band. They heard that & said man, this guy’s good so they called me when they came to L.A. They were still on tour but they had to cancel a couple of shows & get another drummer. They called me to go down to one of the rehearsal studios they were rehearsing in & I went down there & met them. Actually I went the night before & met Tony Iommi & the tour manager, this guy Paul Clark. We talked a little bit & I gave ‘em the Axis album. Tony liked it & then the next day they called me & told me to come on down. So then I played with ‘em a little bit & they thought it was great, so that was the beginning of us being together.

Then I had to learn all the songs, but there was always a chance that Bill Ward was supposed to be coming back. So I was just filling in but then as the tour went on & on & on obviously Bill didn’t come back. Then it was time to do another record so they asked me to stay in the band & do the next record with ‘em, which was The Mob Rules & then from there we did one more record called Live Evil.

MH: There’s a drum solo on that one.

VA: Oh yeah, I haven’t heard that in so long. I don’t even know what’s on there (laughing).

MH: Did Tony ask you to play the songs pretty much like Bill had done?

VA: Yeah, they gave me all CD’s & stuff, back then it was tapes, of how he played it. On a lot of the parts I played it the same & then as we got to know each other I started putting my style into it & it felt right & no one ever said anything. I think what happens is when you’re on tour so much you don’t listen to the original songs anymore, even the songs that you write. You start playing ‘em a little differently. You get used to them & everybody gets used to them & it becomes almost a new song. But they never mentioned anything about it. If it was wrong they would but they were pretty spot on.

MH: Who were your biggest influences? Was the Sabbath stuff right up your alley?

VA: I remember hearing Sabbath as a kid. My friend said man you ought to hear this album. It was the first Black Sabbath album. I went to his house & listened to it and it was pretty scary sounding. That was the first album where I went wow, that’s freakin freaky! But it didn’t knock me out. I thought it was cool but I didn’t like the small drum sound. I was more into the Bonzo-Zeppelin thing. The big drum set & bigger drum sound & that whole thing. I thought the Sabbath stuff had a sound of its own. I thought it was pretty evil sounding but I didn’t like the drums being that small. They were really small sounding. I listened to it but I wasn’t a big fan of it. So when I had the offer it was like well it’s a cool band but I wasn’t like a fan going in & going wow, I’m here, holy shit! Which was actually better because then I looked at it more professionally like okay we’ve got work to do, let’s do it.

MH: And at that point Sabbath wasn’t considered the classic band that they are now.

VA: Yeah, you’re absolutely right. And the influences were mainly John Bonham, my brother (Carmine) and then I listened to a lot of Buddy Rich & Mitch Mitchell from Jimi Hendrix, those were my heroes.

MH: The Experience wouldn’t have been the same at all without Mitch.

VA: Oh yeah, he just kicked ass man. That was great stuff. A lot of these bands wouldn’t have been the same without the drummers they had. Zeppelin & Mitch Mitchell, these guys added personality to the music & the sound to the music. That’s what I’d listened to all my life so that’s why when I wanted to play & started getting in these bands I wanted to go for more of that, of not playing it safe with the drums, more of adding a style with the drums to the music.  Then people could hear it & go oh I know who’s playing drums on that. You develop your own style (that way) too. A lot of people play it safe, they don’t take the chance to get into the song & play some cool shit in there. I always play for drummers that are gonna listen. When I learned how to play I’d learned a lot from listening to a Zeppelin song or album & that’s the way I felt it should be. If you’re gonna listen to a Dio album I’m gonna put some stuff in there so the drummers go woah, what was that & that’s cool, I’d like to learn that, or even to inspire people to play a little bit more. Not to over-play but just do it so it feels right.

MH: At what point did Ronnie & yourself decide to form the DIO band?

VA: That was after we did the Live Evil album with Sabbath. They were kind of breaking up. They couldn’t get along. Decisions were being made between different people & it wasn’t me so much obviously, but it was Ronnie & Tony & Geezer. It wasn’t working out anymore so Ronnie decided he was leaving & he said I’m gonna form my own band, do you wanna join me, so I thought alright, that should be cool. Ronnie said he was leaving the band so I left with him & then we formed Dio. He knew of Jimmy Bain. He called Jimmy & Jimmy knew of Vivian Campbell, so we went to London & we jammed together. It sounded cool & we thought well Viv’s the guy. He wanted to do it & that’s how we got the initial band together.

MH: Were any other guitar players considered?

VA: There was actually Jake E. Lee. He played with Ronnie & I & this was in L.A. But Ronnie decided he wanted more of an international touch for the band, somebody from Europe, so we went over to Europe. That’s when he called Jimmy. He wanted Jimmy to play bass & then Jimmy came down & he recommended Vivian. Vivian came down & played with us & it was just really monstrous, so we both thought he was the guy so then we asked him to join the band.

MH: Vivian was on fire back then. He doesn’t play like that anymore.

VA: Yeah, well he can’t play like that in Def Leppard (laughing), that’s a different kind of music. It’s more song oriented & more poppy. The stuff Dio was doing was more heavy metal, so Viv was screaming. He was a killer player. That’s why when he heard him when we played together we went yeah this is the guy, this guy kicks ass & we all played well together.

MH: Did shifting from Sabbath to DIO open up things for you creatively as a drummer?

VA: It opened up more because I wasn’t under the thing of well this has gotta sound like Black Sabbath. That’s what happened. That band was so established, even when we did Mob Rules. It still had to be in that Sabbath realm. With DIO it was like this is brand new from the beginning. It was a brand new project from the beginning & anything goes. That’s the way it went so there were no boundaries, so that was fun.

MH: When you recorded Holy Diver did you sense that it could become such a classic years later?

VA: No, not at all. We were just having a good time doing it & recording it. We wrote the first 4 songs, I don’t know which ones they were, then we were at Sound City recording & rehearsing at the same place as recording; Sound City Complex. They had a rehearsal room there. We would rehearse & say let’s record next week & we’d drag all the equipment across the street, bring it in & play & record the songs. We didn’t have any idea that it was gonna be like that. We were just making the best record we could & then when we heard it we thought it was pretty good. Then when it came out it was doing great but we never thought it would last this long. It’s still being bought & it’s still being played. It’s pretty amazing.

MH: DIO had huge stage shows in the 80’s. What stood out from touring with those shows?

VA: The thing that stood out a lot was when you have that big of a show with a lot of pyro & all these effects the show’s gonna work & the fans are gonna go nuts, even if you didn’t play good. You’ve got so much power with all that stuff on stage, but we never let up. We didn’t ever slack off, going well I’m a little tired tonight. We never did that, but the big show in combination with the band, back then the band was on fire. It was a spectacular show. Sometimes some of the stuff in the show wouldn’t work & you had to deal with those kinds of issues. But all in all it was fantastic going on with such a big show.

MH: Here in Norman there was the incident where Vivian got burned with some pyro (in 1985).

VA: Yeah, one time he was in the wrong spot & the thing went off & his leg got burned a little bit. It was okay but he was just in he wrong place. We never had anybody get hurt, I don’t think anybody really got hurt. With a lot of pyro on stage you’ve got to be careful. A lot of times the pyro is supposed to go off at one time & sometimes it would go off sooner & that would blow your eardrums out. You’ve just got to be careful with that.

MH: Did that change the bands safety precautions after that incident?

VA: Yeah, we had some meetings & made sure the pyro guy was aware of where people were when he was going to set this pyro off, if he’s not looking & setting it off on a cue that’s not good either. Obviously things change on stage a lot. People are in different places & you’ve got to be aware of what’s happening when you’re using that stuff & we had a lot of it.

MH: When you started switching guitar players do you think that affected the bands chemistry?

VA: Yeah, obviously the magic was with the original band. There were a lot of business things going on with not sharing in a lot of the profits & that turned people off. When you get that kind of situation the waters get rough & then people aren’t happy. That to me makes un- happy music. You make good music when people are having a good time & having fun, like on the first 2 albums that’s the way it was. But when people are complaining & they’re not happy then the music suffers. So the first one to go was Viv. He wanted to do his own thing & Ronnie wasn’t getting along with him so Ronnie wanted to get another guitar player. That’s a big thing changing guitar players. Then we got Craig Goldy & to me Craig didn’t fit in the band very well. He was just in the band cause he was there on the side. That was a big change & then we started writing music for the next album with Craig & it wasn’t as good. Things changed a lot. In the beginning it was a big fun thing. Everybody had their say, then when we got Craig, Ronnie tried to take more control of the music & the direction & there were more keyboards. Then it started turning into more of a job rather than creativity & having a good time making great music.

MH: Was it an influence on you to see your brother playing drums with different bands?

VA: I used to go see Carmine play when I was really young, like 8-9 years old. I used to go see Vanilla Fudge play.  I was influenced by that, I thought wow this is cool, I wanna do this, this is a fun thing to do, instead of getting a job (laughs). I didn’t think of it that way, I was just greatly inspired by it so then I was playing a little bit & I thought well I better play good because Carmine’s a really good drummer & if I’m gonna do this I’m gonna have to kick some ass. I took it seriously & practiced all the time & went to drum lessons & did the whole thing. I took it very seriously. I always played every day & made sure I was on top of the ball.

MH: How would you compare the climate for hard rock bands now to the 80’s?

VA: Well it’s come back a lot, all the DIO stuff & Sabbath stuff. Everything became classic & legendary but the whole business has changed. Back in the 80’s all the bands would get big budgets. $500,000 record deals, million dollar record deals, there was a lot of money involved. It was a big thing. Now a lot of people are doing it online like we did with this 3Legged Dogg CD. There are not a lot of big deals out there unless you’re big already. You’ve got to try to find a way to make it work these days. I think it’s a little harder today.

MH: Metal was mainstream & underground then.

VA: Yeah, now it’s commercial & everybody wants a single or something. Radio has changed. A lot of stations are just playing classic rock. I don’t think there’s quite as much of an outlet for new bands unless they do it themselves, it’s weird.

MH: Do you think it’s important for drummers to get involved with the songwriting process?

VA: Absolutely, you should always get involved in the writing, even if you don’t play another instrument. You should be able to hear the songs. If you’ve got some parts you can always sing a melody of something & get involved that way. That’s what I’ve always done & I don’t play guitar. I play a little bass but I was always in on all the songs & I put my two cents in. If you play guitar you can pick up a guitar & go what about this chorus & play a couple chords.  There’s other ways to do it even if you don’t play, just with ideas & thinking. I always hear all sorts of shit going through my head when we’re creating songs. When we’re writing I can hear different changes & I can sing them out & say why don’t we go to this change here & different things like that. There’s ways to communicate it.

 * Interview by Joe D./Metal Hell '06